So I did some searching and yep, some bastard has posted what looks to be every Star Fronties product. Complete with the original copyrights stating you can't copy them! 

It has little notes about being for "educational" purposes. 

This guy needs to be shutdown. 

Anthony Valterra
Business Manager Roleplaying Games
Wizards of the Coast
###.###.8045

Thank you for your very kind request!

But I just HAVE to ask a couple of questions (as I delete the requested
links)

How come:
#1 that it was fine for us to post everyhting 6 years ago when we Formally
Asked?

#2 we were also given permission to create a certain number of CD-ROMs
containing such items for NO PROFIT?

#3 if you search for Star Frontiers and ANY search engine .. you'll find
that I attained most of the items from Others who have them posted on their
own sites MUCH longer than on SF.COM (which has been for over 6 yrs now) ..

#4 certain Creators/Designers/Owners are all too happy to have certain items
online (as they helped create them as well) and also play SF at our local
Gaming League every so often .. and also have us (.com & .org) post their
creations as well.

#5 need I also delete the Minatures and Counters as well?

#6 .. need I also send replies to those said WebMasters of the various
others pages too to have them remove the Rules and Modules from their pages
as well? Or will you need a link to those pages so your office can handle
it? (I am on -normally- good terms with those Web Masters if'n you'd like
for me to ask them first to remove the links ..

Sincerely,
Timothy Norris
SF.COM Web Master
###-###-0421

PS: the WoTC and TSR and HASBRO Copyright links have been deleted as per
your kind request .. Tim

I have an official letter from TSR (about 9 months before they were bought by WotC) granting me permission to collect n scan all the official stuff and burn 30 CD's (+ 1 to send to TSR). 

And the starfrontiers@iastate.edu had a TSR/WotC employee on it who said for at least a year that all our stuff online was being tolerated until TSR had an official place on TSR.com to put the stuff we'd generated. 

We're still waiting to hear back about when they're ready for us to move it over. And as soon as I get that 30 CD's burnt, I'll send TSR their copy. 

roymeo 

<<I really hope that the guy who posted these works for everyone to download for free has done so with the permission of the authors, but I couldn't find anything which said as much on the website. It may be old and out of print, but that hasn't stopped other games from making a comeback - Dark Conspiracy, Space:1889, etc. All it takes is an interested party willing to seek out the original creators and invest a little capital. If you get a revival, that means at least some amount of profit and the possibility of new supplements. I keep hoping someone brings back 2300 AD...>> 

Actually, Star Frontiers was released back inthe early 80's. Back in those days, it was standard TSR policy to own the rights to all print and art contained in their products - as soon as the game designers and artists completed a product, TSR owned the rights - no creator control. 

The principal designers of Star Frontiers were Dave "Zeb" Cook and Lawrence Schick. Dave Cook eventually left the gaming community and as of a few years ago was reportedly managing AOL's online gaming content; for unrelated reasons, a member of the SF listserv tried to get in touch with him about the game but got no response. The SF listserv has held several small SF-only conventions since 1999> Matt Crymble, the organizer of the first 3 (SciCon 1-3) contacted Lawrence and actually set up a phone-in interview with him at on of these conventions. We bombarded Lawrence with a variety of questions and he had fun answering them; if anything, he seemed flattered that anyone still remembered the game and kept it alive. On a side note, he mentioned that when he left TSR in the early 80's they forced him to sign a gag order preventing him from releasing any material related to, or derivative of, the Star Frontiers system. At a subsequent convetion, we had a similar phone-in Q&A with Kim Eastland (creator of the "Zebulon's Guide to Frontier Space" rules supplement); Kim was also happy to hear the system was being kep t alive by its fans.. 

In short, the creators have no rights to the now long out of print Star Frontiers game; on publication, TSR took complete control of the rights to the system and everything related to it. There are no plans for TSR / WOTC / Hasbro to release the game in any form (particularly now that they dicthed their own Alternity line to gain the Star Wars license). The SF material posted to the web harms noone, profits noone, and keeps the game alive for the fans who are still out there. 

If someone was writing and selling SF material for a profit, there would be a clear reason for going after them. As it is, fans of the game are keeping it alive out of love of the game and the hobby, not greed. Personally, I think a little tolerance is in order. 

If you really had official permission, then you don't have a problem, and
your appropriate response was to laugh at Phil and say "Nope, here's our
permissions, go away."

If you didn't have permission, then you deserve to be closed down and taken
to court for massive copyright and trademark infringement.

I will say that, looking at your site, it doesn't look like you had
permission. It doesn't even look like you really THOUGHT you had
permission. The weasel words about "private educational purposes" and "no
trademark or copyright infringement is intended" are typical of pirates.
There are a lot of clueless little weasels out there who think that if they
say "no infringement is intended," they can get away with infringing. Now,
I don't know if you are one of these clueless weasels or not, but if you
are legit, you should try not to look just like a cheesy pirate d00d.

If you really had (or can now get) permission, you need to show it openly.
A real permission REQUIRES you to show, prominently, that the material is
used by permission. It will require you to say "Used by permission" or
"Used under license." Failing to do that can injure the status of the
trademark (bogus "no challenge" disclaimers are meaningless). If you look
like thieves you have to expect to be treated like thieves.

As to why he didn't call you first - because if you WERE innocent,
reporting you to Hasbro harms nothing. And if you were guilty, you should
be slammed hard - NOT given a warning so you can close this site, slip
away, and pop up on some other server!

The only issue I have with Phil is - I am not sure he should have posted to
RPG.net. He could have just busted you and let your first warning be from
the Hasbro lawyers. On the other hand, by posting to RPG.net he took a very
brave and public stand against piracy, and maybe it'll set a good example
for others.

There is a group of people who really love their little pirate weasels
because they like getting free games.  Some of those people are very noisy,
and whine loudly when their freebies are taken away. But I think the
community of people who will stand up to the pirates is really much bigger.

Here's what I'd like you to do; let me know if you have another idea, or
if anything I ask is troublesome.

* First, continue doing what you've been doing all along. It looks great.
You can even restore the links to old products and rules.

* Second, please continue to carefully and fully attribute ownership of
trademarks and copyrights to Wizards of the Coast, as you have been doing
so well all along.

* Third, if and when we convert any of those old SF products to ESDs and
post them on the WotC Web site, then we'll ask you to remove the links
again, and direct interested people to the WotC site, where they'll pay a
modest fee to download them. It would be appreciated if you didn't post
any "download now while they're still free" messages, but instead provided
them freely until we are in a position to offer them, ourselves, if ever.

* Fourth, REMOVED DUE TO CONTROL ANY RUMORS OF FUTURE PENDING INFORMATION

...

We are in the process of drafting a "free license" agreement, to be used
by folks such as yourself, who continue to generate activity using
inactive brands at no profit. Our Legal Department is very busy, and the
agreement is a bit low on its priority list, but once it's drafted, we'll
get you copy to sign for our mutual protection. In the meantime, this
email serves as permission to continue with your present activities until
such time as we contact you and request changes.

Please let me know if this is acceptable to you. Thanks for your hard work
through the years, and your obvious commitment to quality. We don't
lightly grant permission to pursue projects such as yours, and it's good
to see that you have taken such good care of our brand. Well done.

David Wise
RPG Clubs and Subsidiary Rights Director
Brand Manager, Star Wars RPG